I'm Your Buddy
A film and TV podcast hosted by best friends, Nick and William. Join us weekly as we watch imperfect but excellent works and discuss storytelling, friendship, and, in our current season, the film and tv scripts of Alex Garland!
I'm Your Buddy
Episode 230: We'll Look Like Morons If We Screw This Up
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
This week we watch S1E8 " I Can Hear His Heartbeat: The Struggle For Trost Part 4" S1E9 "What Happened To His Left Arm/Attack On Trost Part 5" and S1E10 "The Response/Attack On Trost Part 6". We discuss emotionally relating to people, an Alex Garland connection, and "the show finally "starting"."
Hello and welcome to season 11 of I'm Your Buddy with Nick and William, a podcast where two best friends are watching and discussing the anime series Attack on Titan. I'm William, who's never seen the show.
SPEAKER_02And I'm Nick who has also never seen the show.
SPEAKER_00Alright, buckle up. Today we are talking about episode eight. I can hear his heartbeat. Colon, the struggle for trost part four. Episode nine, what happened to his left arm slash attack on trost part five. And episode ten, the response, slash attack on trost, part six. Interesting. I don't know what happened with episode eight, and it wasn't it's the struggle for. I like that. I don't know what's going on. Yeah, it's all over the place. Sure.
SPEAKER_02How are you today, William? It's only been three days since we've what past recorded two days?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, we recorded Friday, hung out Saturday, practiced kissing behind the Smiths on Fourth Street Sunday. Sure. And I'm back here uh recording again. Nice. I'm okay. Yeah. I'm not. I don't care. Are you how are you? Some got some in MCR, huh? I just yeah, that's so funny. I just feel cranky. Work is busy and like right before I left, I came into some BS. And then life is life. So it's like, I don't know. Why am I supposed to feel any different or any better? Like, why? You tell me. But you're not supposed to tell me. You're not allowed to tell me. It's up for me. Everybody's different. Yeah, I don't know how to answer that question. There's no question. Don't worry about it. Yeah. There's no question. There's a constant.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I mean it's a it's tough. It's tough. Yeah, I'm I'm pretty much right there with you today in terms of I have a head cold that I caught from Leo this weekend. And yesterday I had a good day in terms of uh went over the script for Redeemer Part 2 with Mauricio over a two and a half hour long Google Meet.
SPEAKER_00Well that's cool.
SPEAKER_02Uh so that was fun and he's stoked to get started on that. So it's my usual Nikki B. Yeah. Have a high one day, gotta have a low the next. But really I'm just fucking tired and drained and drained.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. The other day I was listening to music and someone asked me, What song am I listening to? It's one of those Instagram things where they were filming you. No. And you're like, oh, it's a joke. You say some random, like track four of Armored Core Four Fires of Rubicon soundtrack.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, live feed to my ex's kitchen. I left a thing there. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00No, what uh uh just a friend asked, What song are you listening to? And I was gonna tell him, and I was like, I just made it up because I didn't want to explain too much, because it was a Frank Ocean song, and the opening line is my guy is pretty like a girl. And I was like, I don't wanna I don't have to explain this. I don't have to get into my sexuality with this person, it's not my sexuality, it's my heterosexuality, listening to homosexuality and being okay with that. But I was like, let's just I don't know. It's all okay.
SPEAKER_02Well, we've been telling you that for years. Um speaking of listening to things, I did listen to the new Phoebe Bridgers over the weekend on a run.
SPEAKER_00Uh Lost Ones, Lost Boys, Lost Boys, something like that.
SPEAKER_02Lost Ones is a AFI song, I think. That's it's very, very on on on nose, on the nose for for AFI. Um or Peter Pan. That's Peter Pan, right?
SPEAKER_00Lost Boys, yeah. Yeah. V. Oh. Also a pop a pop punk band. True. That's a s that's a sick riff. Yep. It's a sick riff. They had one, guys.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_02That's all you needed. Yeah, yeah, I was great. You just need one. I used to love that riff. Yeah. I don't know if I even had heard that entire album. No. I think it's Phoenix, Texas. I think. No, that's Phoenix TX. That's another band. Or no, is it that that record? I don't know.
SPEAKER_00My brain is fucking scrambled eggs. Hey, I got you as far as that's a band. I can't name the song. I know the riff, couldn't tell you anything more.
SPEAKER_02No, no. It's been way too long. 20, almost 30 years, probably. Who fucking knows? But yes, I listened to Phoebe Bridgagers. Exactly. And which did you listen to Punisher?
SPEAKER_00The previous album? No. Interesting.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, is it good? Is it folksy? Yeah, that's what I wanted to ask. Is this is how does this one compare instrumentally concept-wise to her uh previous one?
SPEAKER_00This one's a little more folksy. The other one is still folksy, that's her thing. Okay, but there's a few songs that have uh a bit more of a a rock to it. Just a bit more, but not like Punisher has more. I would say Punisher's less folksy. This is more folksy. Is more folksy than The Lost Boys, Peter Pan, Rufio.
SPEAKER_02I don't know if Frank would agree with that. But um Wylan Jennings, Outlaw Rock or Outlaw Country. So that's that's more of where she comes from.
SPEAKER_00Uh yeah, and here's the thing. I love her, but she has a thing about her that I should hate and not like.
SPEAKER_02Okay.
SPEAKER_00She's like a protege of Connor Oberst and Bright Eyes. I knew that he did gr they did like two albums together.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00That tracks for me. That tracks for me.
SPEAKER_02Very confessional, very in the moment, like talking about touring and being a musician, adjacent lyrics, that kind of stuff. She feels very much like she comes from, and I and I don't mean this in a negative. I just I've talked about it before of there's songwriter-based songwriters and riff uh-based songwriters, you know what I mean? And she comes, she feels like she comes from the songwriting school. Absolutely. Which I don't connect to as much because I was never a songwriter. I didn't grow up playing piano. Riff boy. I didn't start with acoustic. You don't do poetry. I did start with acoustic guitar, but I ston't don't start with lyrical concepts, that kind of stuff. So that tracks, and and this new record does sound a lot like I could see some of the Connor influence. Elliot Smith. Big Elliot Smith. So much Elliott Smith. Oh, yeah. Uh so much Sufi and Stevens. Shit ton of Sufi and Stevens. And uh a bit of Radiohead as well, which when you showed me that second track on the record uh last week before we recorded it, I was like, Oh, it sounds like Radiohead.
SPEAKER_00And she has said that with this album, is she was in a big Radiohead phase.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that makes total sense. And in a lot of the compositions, it makes sense. Yeah, I think there's some good songs on there. It's definitely not for me in terms of like the uh I don't know. I was it's one of those things where I respect it, but I'm never gonna listen to it again.
SPEAKER_00Is it too real for you, Nick? Absolutely. Absolutely not.
SPEAKER_02It's not even that emotional. No, no, I don't and it's one of these interesting things where while it is kind of intimate uh lyric-wise, it's actually not that intimate. It's more generic in terms of like generalities, not generic in terms of negative.
SPEAKER_00And that's tricky because it's super personal autobiography autobiographical. So for it to be generic and that is an interesting opinion.
SPEAKER_02I mean it's it's specific, but it's nothing I haven't heard before. Yeah. And she has some really great lines. Can I name any of them? No.
SPEAKER_00Not today.
SPEAKER_02And bug pinch. I think half of that is I'm sick, and I think half of that is it they didn't stick in my mind.
SPEAKER_00It's not for you, for sure.
SPEAKER_02But but I respect a lot of them, and uh I don't know. It's it's interesting. I'm just not this the song writer e adjacent kind of stuff, I just I just can't get into it that much. And especially with multi-instrumentalist kind of stuff, I'm always I understand the impulse as a musician, especially if she comes from the folk. That's why I was yeah uh asking what her previous record was like. Because when you're coming from, and we've talked about this with the Mumford stuff a couple episodes ago, of like you come from stripped down uh stripped down sounds, stripped down instrumentals, and then it's like, oh, the world opens up, so let's bring in a bunch of other stuff, bunch of other instruments. And I think I kind of don't like that when it happens to solo artists where they're like, ah fuck it, let's just let's have a thousand fucking instruments on this one record. And I'm just like you don't have to. Like, if you would have worked on the melody for this song a little bit more, or or or you know, ran with one of the cool ideas that's in this song, the song would be better for it, but instead it becomes a collage of sound, which maybe that's intentional, and it just doesn't speak to me. So, I mean, everything is intentional when it comes to recording music, especially over a long period of time. So I I'm I'm not gonna knock her and I'm not gonna I don't think it's a criticism upon her. It's just listening to the music. I'm like, oh, okay, I I see where people come from and and really dig in this. And she's very talented and and people relate to her stuff very deeply because she has a very passionate fan base. Yeah. But I'm like, yeah, it's not it's not my thing necessarily. For sure. Yeah, yeah. But hey, she shouts out, shout out Bo a couple times. He's on a couple songs. Yep. She has a song named after him, and he, you know, so good for them.
SPEAKER_00Sure. Good for them.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Good for them.
SPEAKER_02But what are you, what are your thoughts on the record, having listened to the whole thing? Maybe a time or two.
SPEAKER_00I need to listen to it more. I think the initial thoughts are, I think it's very well done. I think it's very good. Cohesive sound. Other than Kill Me, nothing stands out. I don't know if I have other anything other than some of the music choices that I was showing you. An idea she had for that song, Kill Me. I don't know if anything else stood out yet, but it it's a quiet, soft album, so I gotta listen to it more. There's uh no, it's uh I do think it's great. I do think it's on par with the rest of her stuff. It's not a slump, it's not a cash-in. She's she's still growing, she's still getting good. But the problem I'm having is when Punisher came out, it immediately hit me. Like multiple songs. I was like, holy shit, this is crazy. And this album isn't doing that. Uh-huh. Not her fault.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Maybe she didn't want it to.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00So I'm trying not to do that thing that I do with albums sometimes. Yeah, compare it to one and go, the other one's catchier, therefore I like it. Yeah. Or the other one has more songs I like, therefore it's a better album. Yeah. I can like the album, but admit this one might be better or well written or better written or something. Yeah. But no, I think it's good. It's on par with everything else she's done. I think it's good. I'm definitely gonna keep listening to it for sure. I'll take a break. It's not a summer album. Yeah. But ooh, once those overcast uh fall days come, yeah, this is coming right back on.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it's man, yeah. I really do wish I had more time to listen to quiet records. Like as an adult, I could prioritize it in a way in my life where I'm like, okay, I'm gonna set aside an hour of my time a week to listen to a record sitting down away from my kid or something like that. But it's once everyone goes to bed, I'm just not gonna do that because I'm tired and I have other priorities.
SPEAKER_00And it's not a passion, so it's not the top of the list. It will at a certain point feel like work of like I'm forcing myself to do this.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, because I want to listen to those quiet records because it's so fucking hard to listen to that in a in a car. You know what I mean? That's just very difficult for those low mixed albums. Because they're yeah, I want to get through some of those quiet records, but and it's fine. It was literally every song after the third song, uh-huh. I was like, all right, let me switch to something else. Because I'm on I'm on a run. But then I'm like, no, just fucking power through, don't be a fucking bitch. Yes, it's a chill record. Stop being punk pinch. It's okay, just get through it so you can talk about it on the podcast and see what people are are all about with her. So what's the fuss about? Yeah, no, because I hadn't, you know, she's a big deal. I'd never listened to a full record of hers, and I honestly I couldn't name a song or anything like that. And I'd heard more boy genius than anything else. So yeah, but so I'm glad I listened to it. But yeah, the parts that I like about the music and the songs, I'm like, I want you to run with that a little bit more than you do. I get that, but that just comes down to taste kind of thing, I think.
SPEAKER_00That's uh you you brought up the Radiohead thing, and I was thinking about Radiohead the other day because it feels like a band that everybody of a certain age, you're eventually gonna name them as one of the best or one of your favorite bands, or at least an album. They kind of have that Beatles thing. Yeah, where like, oh, I like the Beatles, but I like this album for like this is the sound of them.
SPEAKER_02This is the six months of the Beatles that I like.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Because it's I would say era, but literally they're only four.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's so short, but like that's how expansive the sounds and the genres switched with them. Yeah, I think Radio Head kind of has that. But I was thinking about them, I was like, I other than the song Creep or like their hits, like maybe two or three, I cannot name any lyrics or what a song's about.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00I just can't do it. I don't he's not a lyricist. I put him, yeah. I put him he's a Cedric. He's a British Cedric. I think he's just saying some fucking mumbo jumbo that fits a melody.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it could be.
SPEAKER_00Sucking on lemons, suck my lemons. Your fucking lyrics don't make sense to me.
SPEAKER_02I mean, his voice very much is an instrument, right? In their music.
SPEAKER_00He does it well. He does, I mean, he does it amazing. Uh well as an understatement. But yeah, I was like this ain't a songwriter I would ever give a shit about, or I would ever have to ask.
SPEAKER_02Lyrically, get out of here. One of my pals in LA, Joe, who I'm gonna see later, uh probably in like six months when we I I'll probably go to see Dune 3 out in LA with those guys. He's a huge Radiohead guy. And I want to talk to him about lyrics because last time I was talking to him, I was doing a the re-listen of Radiohead and texting him about it, and uh probably like a year or two ago. And and he was talking about relating to themes in maybe like their newest record or something like that about heartbreak and stuff, because Tom York had wrote got a divorce and Joe had gone through this divorce too, actually. And there's a human out there that emotionally related to Moonshaped Pool. I know, exactly. So I was like, what the so I gotta I gotta uh pick his brain about that because I I couldn't tell you any radio head lyrics, but I'm also a bad lyrics listener.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's not fair for you, but like yeah, like Karma Police, creep, yeah, and the the sucking lemons, everything in its right place, and I'm done.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Who are we doing? Yeah, you're asking the wrong person. I don't know, but yeah, it that's it's just not my thing. The way he does what he does. Melodies are phenomenal in Rainbows, is my Radiohead. That's great. That's a perfect album. That's a that's a fucking perfect album. Yeah, that's but then I'm thinking about it, I'm like, okay, so Radiohead is uh maybe it's a Johnny Greenwood and whatever their drummer's name is band to me. Cause that album is uh tones and then drums.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Then lyrics are like 50th.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00But there's a lot of bands I have that are like that where I'm like, I don't know what the hell that guy's saying, but it sounds good.
unknownSure.
SPEAKER_00I'm okay with that. I'm very okay with that. I don't need to know what your lyrics are if I'm not here just for lyrics. It's the same with rap. Like, I don't need to know and hear everything every single time. That's fine. It's not it because I don't think every single time I'm supposed to. That's that's not the point at all times. Of music. Yeah. Yeah.
unknownSure.
SPEAKER_00There's more experience.
SPEAKER_02Sure.
SPEAKER_00But you did write lyrics. That's the tricky part. But then again, I'm gonna like lightning bolt has lyrics. Yes. What the fuck are we gonna what are what are we doing? You know what I mean? Like those are songs with lyrics, but is he gonna be mad if I told him I don't know what Rainbow Dracula goddamn cowboy song is about? Yeah, it's like I don't know what you said in the second verse, and he's gonna be like, come on, man.
SPEAKER_02I haven't heard anyone say that band's name in 20 fucking years. Yeah, dude.
SPEAKER_00Whew.
SPEAKER_02Some talk about some fun riffs, some cool shit. Yeah, yeah. God damn. Uh literally 20 years ago. That's so funny. I haven't heard anybody talk about that. That's nuts.
SPEAKER_00Still going in my brain. Are they even together? I don't know. Yeah. I'll ask them. I talk to them all the time. I'm sure you do.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that's yeah, lyrics are tough. I don't know. Because sometimes they're just there. Because obviously, coming from the punk rock school, it's about expressing whatever anger you have towards whatever uh in punk rock, right? And so that's where you kind of express yourself, which actually kind of ties into a topic I want to segue into in a second. But yeah, the lyrics I wrote were never an instrument within the music of the bands, right? Yeah, and same with the you know, hardcore bands, you're just fucking screaming and then you're not saying anything.
SPEAKER_00Wow, they'd be so pissed if you said that.
SPEAKER_02No, well, our it was my band's.
SPEAKER_00Oh, yeah, you mean you were there were never lyrics.
SPEAKER_02No, it was it was just Fredo.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, we're screaming for the the melody and for the moment.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it's about the power of it, it's about uh the abrasiveness, it's about the heaviness of that, you know. So yeah, I don't know. I don't I never written for vocals as an instrument.
SPEAKER_00So it's tricky to think about because I've never written music, but I'm going to not a singer. And I th that's the other part, is like my voice isn't an instrument, and my my my words aren't songs as of right now. In three, two blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah. But like that is a thing of I I think I want to try.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00And I'm like, I it it's like learning a different language. Like you can't just ask me today, start speaking French. I'm like, I don't know, man. Yeah. I gotta like learn that play with it, yeah. Yeah play with it. You wish. But yeah, no, I think about it all the time because I wanna write music and I want to make music and I definitely wanna see what I can do with different genres, and there are certain genres where it's like you can totally get away with not having lyrics that mean anything, yeah. And then there's certain ones where it's like the lyrics are on the front. Yeah. Like if I said I was doing a folk acoustic, it's like okay, well, the lyrics are gonna fucking matter because everyone's listening to what you're saying, and you have a stripped down guitar, and so it's like you can't do that and just mumbo jumbo because Bob Dylan is the last person to get away with that, and he's allowed, and no one else is. He closed that door behind him.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00So I'm just like, fuck, man. I don't know. Yeah, lyrics are weird, vocals are weird, melodies, things like that. And then I get stressed out, you start watching how people construct songs.
SPEAKER_02And then, yeah, this'll tie into what I want to discuss too, but it's about what part of yourself do you want to express, I think, you know. My forearms. Yeah, you know, we've been working on them doing the curls. It's true. Because I was I was thinking about our previous episode and me rambling on about whatever the fuck I was talking about. Cave digger Carl or what that's called. Uh Dungeon Crawler Carl. That's it. That's what it is. Yeah, trying to talk about how this book series I'm reading fits the narrative, fits the idea of I'm your buddy as a podcast, right? And I just fucking ramble on for like 30 or 40 minutes. Hopefully, you cut it down to about five.
SPEAKER_00Um it wasn't a ramble. All of it made perfect sense. I don't talk too much. I in your head, you're like, I'm talking too much. I know, I don't know. I it's every time we have an episode where you talk about someone's like, that was good. I like that one.
SPEAKER_02I didn't believe that at all. I was thinking about it and fucking hating myself over the past couple days because I'm like, this is my problem.
SPEAKER_00I struggle so much with your sexuality and the thing you're about to say to express myself clearly.
SPEAKER_02It's such a fucking challenge to me. This is why I never tell anybody about the things that I'm working on. This is why I hate myself and hate the world. It's there's something about getting the ideas out of my head and out into people's ears, like trying to pitch things or just talking about things that I like. Trying to describe to folks like, oh, I like this because of X is nearly impossible for me, or at least I tell myself that it is. Okay. And I just get frustrated by it. And it's not necessarily that I want people to feel the way I feel about those things, because that's I'm an adult, I know that that's not a true thing, but like all I do most of the day is turn over stories and things that I find interesting in my head, right? Especially depending on what I'm doing, what what mood I am. If I'm writing something, I'm thinking about narrative. Or if we're talking about the podcast, I'm thinking about narrative, or I'm just thinking of things that interest me. It's just ruminating over and over again in my head. And when I try to talk to somebody about it, convey any kind of piece of information about it to someone else, I feel like I fuck it up. And I'm like, so it's not worth it. So I'm never gonna fucking tell anybody about it. I have a question about this. Sure.
SPEAKER_00In your head, do you have it? Sometimes, yes. And then the trouble is wording it to relate to somebody else where they now have it in their head. Or because I'm uh I the the main question is do you have what you think and feel in your head, or do you not even know that yourself?
SPEAKER_02I mean, sometimes it's that I don't know myself, but a lot of times I have articulated in my mind and I haven't been able to get it out of my head correctly. And some of that is I'll be thinking about it three hours ago, and then we sit down to talk, and I don't have that in my head anymore. Yeah, I had it perfectly worded, perfectly thought out in my mind, and I get home after these couple hours have gone past, and I'm fucking tired, and I'm just like, I know I wanted to talk about this, but I don't know. Yeah, you know, it's one of those things, it's a translation thing, but also, yes, I'm a narcissist, so I never think about how I can try to get my words to make sense in other people's heads.
SPEAKER_00It's all about me expressing myself, so I don't consider you in terms of how you're bringing it in because I'm I think most people it and that's where like communication is like a skill set of know your audience and how to get something to them on their level. That's not that is a rare, more rare skill set, sure, but you also have a weird dichotomy where you're saying all of this of I hate myself, I hate the world because I can't express myself. You will also be the person where if you've thought about it enough, you're like, I think I nailed it, and I'm right. And if you present an opinion and it's yours, you will hit a moment of like just fucking trust me. Yeah, with you for sure. With you for sure. You do hit that level of like, fucking just trust me. Yeah, yeah. Like get there quicker. You're behind. Yeah, I figured this out in my head, you punk bitch. Like, I yeah, I there is a mix of sometimes you're like, I don't know, I'm a fucking idiot, and sometimes you're like, the whole world's a fucking idiot, and I nailed this. Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, there's a which I do too. We're two sides of the coin of that for sure. But I I I bring it up with like lyrics in terms of what you're trying to express in music, you know what I mean? If you're doing it through a riff, if you're doing it through a beat, if you're doing it through words themselves, like and I've been curious about like I wonder if I will feel better about communicating my ideas to people once I've published some of my writing, like with the book. If the if I start writing more comic books, yeah, does that feel good to me? Because I because 20 years ago or 25 years ago when I was a kid and I was writing music, that's how I I expressed myself. It's like, oh, I wrote this song, this is what I feel about the war in Iraq.
SPEAKER_00Well, yeah, you're talking about you're making fun of the jokes about your lyrics, but like me and Graham will still meet and hang out and go, Do you remember how cool this riff was? Like your riffs stick.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, which is great. Yeah, you wrote those riffs. Yeah, it's fucking sick. Yeah, there's some cool riffs for sure. Um, which that's great. I love that. I love that I wrote something and it's gonna stick in somebody's head, yeah, right? That's that's amazing.
SPEAKER_00I'll be 50 and I'll still be thinking of a few riffs you've written.
SPEAKER_02No, of course, and that's awesome. I I absolutely love that. And I would like to write some cool stories or something like that that would do the same thing, but but having not written music in 25 fucking years or whatever, and moved mediums, you know, into like film adjacent screenplays and now into into you know comic books and stuff like this, like I'm like, I wonder if I will be able to be nicer to myself or at least feel like I'm conveying a little bit of myself and a little bit of who I am and how I feel and what things I'm interested in exploring through my art now because I haven't had any of that, uh at least for or I feel like I haven't had any of that in 20 years. And I feel like every time I try to express myself in terms of like, oh I like this thing because of these reasons, I just completely fucking bungle it. You think so? And I hate I don't hate the world because they don't understand me. I it's a self-loathing thing, right? I'm just I I'm I'm mad at my fucking self, and then nobody's used to asking me about what I think about things or something like that. I don't know. It's it's some fucked up thing of I I don't ask enough questions. You know this. Yeah, you know what I mean. No one asks me about stuff that I like because I never it's the Uraburos thing. I don't express about the things that I like unless somebody directly asks me, and if they don't directly ask me, I'm not gonna tell them about it. So it's like it's this weird circle of so if nobody asks me about anything, I never I'm not gonna express my opinion about it. I don't know. See, and look, and look, I'm doing it right now. I can't fucking explain to you how I hate it.
SPEAKER_00But to me, and and maybe it's because I'm your best friend, or maybe because I can relate to a little bit of it on a different end, it's like, no, this makes sense to me. What you're saying makes sense to me. The thing that I always talk about that feels related, related to this, not maybe a one-to-one, is I always bring up and you always get mad and go, ah, you're just you're you're shitting on yourself for being so negative, is the way I like to communicate, the way I conversate or even argue or debate. I've never met anybody in my entire life that also likes doing that. Yeah, like it's a problem for most of the people in my life, relationships, family, friendships work. And so there's a part of me that can feel like, yeah, that's where you can feel like an alien. Of like the thing that helps me, everybody in my circle hates it.
SPEAKER_02It rubs them a wrong way, and I can't do it.
SPEAKER_00And it's like, yeah, you're not meant to be here, is the lowest negative self-thought I can have with that. Yeah, is like because I like that and it helps me. Yeah, and they go, Yeah, the world's not built to help you, if that's what does that, and you can feel outside, you can feel, and that's where the self-loathing is like, yeah, no, I don't hate the world, like you're saying, is like I can feel of like, yeah, I'm not a part of it. Yeah, because the way I'm thinking is hard for other people, yeah. Or feel on the outside, but it's also just in general hard.
SPEAKER_02Sure. Yeah, I do get that, yeah, for sure. I I understand that. Yeah, it makes you feel a little crazy.
SPEAKER_00I think you're very not very, you're clear in your opinions and why, because you don't ramble. I ramble. The example of me rambling is I'll either say one thing four or five times in a row, sure, or I say the same thing five different ways. Yeah. Where you can almost always cut me off, go skip to the end. Yeah. Just say it once and you're done. Like you got a good sound bite, walk away. Yeah. You don't have that problem because you do that. You have the thing, you can present it, you give the one or two examples and say, That's what I'm talking about. And everyone can go, yeah, that makes sense. I don't know. I think you're you're pretty good at that. You maybe the thing that you're talking about that's different is your emotions, like uh how you feel about something. Uh yeah. Not I like this because, but how it makes you feel or what you're connecting or feeling with art. Maybe you don't express that the way you think you do.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, that's a good, uh, I think that's a good observation. Maybe it is that, because that's where the frustration comes from. That's an emotion, right?
SPEAKER_00Because that's yeah, all emotions are valid, just for how long. And maybe some last longer than they should. Yeah, yeah. But yeah, uh, that's the thing of like you can say you like something, the emotional connection is also how you connect with other people.
SPEAKER_02Yes.
SPEAKER_00This makes me sad. Now I know sadness in Nick and what brings that. Yeah, it's so now I know you on a deeper level.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I think that, yeah, that is fascinating. Yeah, trying, yeah, the emotional side of it. Because that's what I'm trying to convey a lot of times like, oh, I find this fascinating or I find this exciting, and these are the things that are exciting or fascinating about it to me. And I feel like if I botch that, then people aren't gonna know who I am or understand me.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Yeah. Because the easiest shorthand to it is you say your favorite part of the Spider-Man movie is when he gave up and stopped swinging, and you're telling this to your co-workers because you're having a birthday cake and the girl's gonna see it tonight for her birthday with her fiance, and you say that was your favorite part, and everyone just looks at you, and then your boss goes, I didn't think I was gonna be in a meeting at work where someone said they stopped swinging and just gave up. He goes, I didn't think I was gonna hear that today. And I was like, I don't think anyone knows who I am in this room. Yeah, and it's so quickly for them to go, I don't get you. Yeah, and it's like oh shit, yeah, oh shit, pull the cord, like eject, eject, eject. Yeah, because yeah, like if you get why that meant so much to me as a joke and as an honest like representation of something, you get me. Yeah, yeah, because I was listening to the podcast and they were talking about Spider-Man. This says so much about this person on the podcast, they said one of the most horrible things that's ever existed in any movie. Spoilers, is when Peter and MJ kiss and you find out it's not MJ. Yeah, and he was so like that's the I was so it rageful, and I was like, Yeah, that's a man that's been burned by women. Yeah, like he has an anger of that exploited, cheated, lied to by women. Yeah, and that came out in that scene because for me in that scene, I just felt sad for him. I was like, God damn, dude, the point with your heart that hurts so much. I didn't have anger, yeah. I didn't have rage of like I didn't have that, but someone watches that scene and that's the part that sticks out to them.
SPEAKER_02For sure.
SPEAKER_00Everyone's coming from their own experience, yeah, yeah, and that yeah, the connecting through art, now you're like, I know you see you. I think whatever your narcissism or your ego, whatever that is, I think is more the problem than your inability to express yourself because I think you're a whole lot better at it than you think you are, but I think because you're not connecting with other people emotionally through art, yeah. I think you might be assuming people aren't doing it with you either. And I think more people are connecting with you than you are them, but that's why I said I think your narcissism and your ego is more the barrier than your uh ability to do so.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, for sure. I mean, I'm telling myself a story and thinking my thinking about myself at all times, and yeah, it's yeah, it's interesting. Because yeah, I mean you I mean, even just last I don't know, but yeah, it's it's fascinating to think of different ways that people express themselves. And yeah, how do you convey to people who you are? I mean, out even outside of shared interests, because usually when you're friends with somebody, you have shared interests, right? That's like the foundation of a friendship and stuff like that, or foundation of a even an acquaintance. Yeah. You know, you both shop at the same place or you have a glancing interest in the same thing, blah blah blah, whatever. But like, yeah, how do you discover who someone is without ants uh like asking questions? And maybe that's kind of what I was getting at is stepping out of my comfort zone. That's what it was. Me saying this extremely obvious thing of like, oh, you know what? And in uh consuming art outside of what I usually consume has really changed my perspective or whatever the fuck is that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and I said, No way.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, exactly. Yeah, which it's an obvious thing, but like it's a challenging thing because as much as you can know that in concept, like I don't I didn't I don't and didn't realize how small my world had become. Because it just ha I think it happens naturally when you have a young kid and you just focus in on that, your world is a lot smaller. It's more of your family unit, and you're not thinking of so you're you're reverting to comfort when it comes to external forces, right? So, like I can't see as many movies as I used to see, we don't watch as much TV as we used to watch just because I don't have as much time and I'm fucking tired. And the things that I do consume a lot are through the podcast, or maybe something that you suggest, or something that someone else suggests, but like I'm not as exploratory at this point in my life. So I didn't my brain is constantly thinking about this one thing, my kid, and then in terms of creativity, like I've just been thinking about Redeemer, that's all I've been working on for the past fucking year and a half, and it's what I'm gonna be working on for the next couple years. So, like, I mean, I have a fucking giant stack of shit I gotta read. That's the that's a over a year's worth of things that I gotta read that I've purchased and I just haven't done it. So it's like I haven't been expanding outside of the things that already exist in my head that much, yeah. Unless I go to the movies, and usually when it's a movie, it's it's a fucking Chris Renolan movie. What is that gonna change my fucking life?
SPEAKER_00No, yeah, you're watching fun movies, yeah. Because they're like, I got two hours. Yeah. Do I want to watch something mind-blowing or fun?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, exactly. And the little movies where I'm like, oh, that's probably a really interesting movie, I miss those. And then I'm like, I'll watch it at home. I don't have fucking time to watch it all.
SPEAKER_00So you're too busy rewatching Chris Renolan movies.
SPEAKER_02So so because he's your favorite. So I I thought Zack Snyder was my favorite, but that telescoping, that winnowing of my perspective happened without me realizing it. Like I didn't fucking know that that was going on until I kind of stepped out. And I think having the season of of season 10 of this podcast where we watched a filmmaker who we both fucking adore and we're revisiting shit that we like. Yeah. So like we hadn't been stretched that much for you know a handful of months or something like that, right? But consuming these two things at the same time, Attack on Titan and Dungeon Caller Carl, where it's like it is that rough thing that develops into something very fucking fascinating. And my brain had forgotten about that for the past year, basically, if not longer. Just and it's a completely unintended. I didn't even think about it. Just like, oh shit. Maybe this is what happens to older people's brains. You get boomer brain, you know what I mean? Like you get scared of the world, these kind of things.
SPEAKER_00There's there's a little bit of that, but I also And did I just coin the phase boomer brain? Probably trademark making B. That's a pretty good one. Yeah, I haven't heard that before.
SPEAKER_02Alliteration. I like alliteration.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Uh if anybody, it's it's it could be Timmy D, yeah. Yeah, but I yeah, some of it's a little you're you're a father, you're a husband and a father, and you're in your late 30s. I think another piece of this is you're in work mode with your creative endeavor. You got it, you got your story, you got your script, you got your idea. You're you're actually doing it, you're putting the work in. Because this is while you were saying that, I was like, I do take walks at work for my lunch break and stuff, yeah. And I just listen to music. I don't listen to podcasts while I walk, I listen to music. While I'm listening to music, I'm writing down ideas of like, ooh, this bass idea, or like cut this out, and this be the drum, like uh lyrics that like come to me, or song ideas, or just a concept. Like, I'm right, I'm giving I'm grabbing stuff. Yeah, yeah. I watch a TV show and I'm like, that made me think of this, and I'm just grabbing things. Oh, that's cool. And so I have a huge notes app list of just a million different ideas. I'm just grabbing things.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Because I'm not making anything.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, you're in a brainstorm for a lot of things.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so my brain's in that world where I'm just sucking whatever in to see if it goes. I'm just gaped open, accepting anything that wants to come in to come in.
SPEAKER_02Yep.
SPEAKER_00My guy's pretty like a girl. Like I'm just grabbing everything.
SPEAKER_02Of course.
SPEAKER_00You're in work mode. You're no longer like needing to think of things. You got it thought, you done thought it, and now you're making it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. At this point, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Cause I think uh I think that's part of it. A little bit, but it's also it might just be, yeah, I think you're transitioning in your brain of ah dude, I'm sorry, but like being tired affects people. Like that's real.
SPEAKER_02Oh, yeah, of course.
SPEAKER_00You've been tired every day for three years now. Four years, to be honest. Because during pregnancy it's not easy. So like you've been tired for so long, so like your brain energy. Oh, yeah, it's much. I mean that's you have to focus it. Well, you have to like I can do three things instead of like eight. Yeah. Back in the day. You're like, I got time and energy for three big things.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, for sure.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that's that's for sure a thing.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, you have a limited bandwidth for sure. But I don't know. But it is having realized that it's like, okay, I uh I do need to actively step outside of my comfort zone a little bit more, which is a good thing because yeah, the hits they're already embedded. Yeah, so like it's fun to revisit stuff, and it will be very fun to revisit classics and stuff with Leo. But yeah, I think you know, I don't know, f for the rest of the year, but I think that'll be a goal of 2027 is like, all right, let's consume some new stuff. Let's step out of my comfort zone a little bit and try to consume some new stories. And if it if they don't talk to me, that's fine. I don't have to like take some massive undertaking of like, oh, let me fucking read all of One Piece, even though I don't like fucking nautical theme or whatever. I'm not gonna do that because I don't want to waste my time if it's not really, really for me. But yeah, stuff that is consumable and it's not too overwhelming, it's a visible amount of time, you know. Yeah, it's doable. Yeah, I think that's I would like that. That's valid. Yeah, try try to do that a little bit more because I am gonna have to switch back to the creative brain. Um well, yeah. Well, I my writer's brain is is is gonna be rearing its head and at the beginning of the year because I I gotta I'm mapping out the rest of the story and all that stuff for the next the actual bulk of the series and stuff like that. So but I still gotta do a bunch of stuff in between now and then.
SPEAKER_00I have another question for you. I just thought of this while you were saying, and then you referenced uh your boy getting excited. You you referenced you're excited to show him stuff later on, like because you're saying play the hits.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00How do you feel about what he consumes when it comes to music versus TV or movies and stuff? Because the the rule, and I think you maybe were similar, but probably not, but there is the joke of like my dad was okay at a very young age, me consuming violence, not nudity. So I can watch a radar movie where guys are getting their heads blown off and knives in their chest, but if a lady takes her shirt off and he's like, ah, what the hell is this shit? Like he hated that. Like, yeah, no sex, but violence in my house was always okay.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah. Well, military family.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, he thinks it's cool because that's that's a big part of his. He's uncomfortable with the the sex, but he thinks violence is cool. So like I'm six years old playing Mortal Kombat 2 and announcing people.
SPEAKER_02Bill doesn't like getting laid. Gotcha on the record.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Three times. Yeah, and well that confirm kills exactly what we know of, yeah. And maybe six tops just to like just to check. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um I was thinking about that as like it it's easy to be like, well, my kid's sensitive or he's easily scared, so you don't do horror, you don't want to do anything too violent because it's jarring, blah blah blah blah blah. What about music? I get the visual, but what about music?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I mean, it's we've let him listen to whatever, you know what I mean? And we're getting a little more sensitive about curse words, but I don't know. He doesn't really repeat. I don't know if we The only stuff that he likes to really listen to, at least now, is like since my sister's wedding, about well, I guess what? It's August Jesus Christ, or like 10 months ago. He's just been loving music from the 1980s.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02So we'll put on that like a 1980s playlist on Apple Music or something like that. 80s on eight. Yeah, and really what he attaches to is like weird instrumentation. There's one weird song I can't remember the fucking name of it. He's listened to it a thousand fucking times, but it's be it's because it has some wacky synthesizer and he fucking loves it. He just thinks it's so fascinating. So that's what he's connecting to. He's not connecting to the lyrics or anything like that at this moment. But yeah, I don't know. Well it'll be interesting to see as he gets older. Because I just want him to enjoy what he enjoys, and we'll we'll expose him to stuff for sure, but I don't really listen to that much violent lyrical content, anyways.
SPEAKER_00You know, but would that be your concern? Like, do you actually have that in your head of we gotta be careful with what he's listening to? Like you don't want it too aggressive, not even lyrically, just like musically.
SPEAKER_02Oh, aggression. Oh, I don't give a shit in it in music. He I mean he likes fast drums and stuff like that.
SPEAKER_00So like is is there a point in him only is he at what age is he too young for boxcar racer? Where you're like that's too uh that's too moody and angsty for I don't know.
SPEAKER_02No, no, I don't think that's because all that I I think of just like eras, you know, the Great Malinko. And you have to well, I was this you know, me and Jeff were cranking the Great Malinko when we were like fucking nine, you know what I mean? So not that we just thought it was funny, right? You know, yeah, we I cannot tell you how funny me and Jeff thought the shirt can't sleep clowns will eat me was when we were like seven and eight, man. That was the funniest fucking thing we'd ever heard. That and the concept of an atomic bullet was the coolest fucking thing to me and Jeff when we were kids. Just you know, typical 90s children. But I don't know, it's it's with how weird my brain is about explaining like the actual details about things to Leo, uh, which I'm sure no one who listens to this podcast uh understands uh my obsession with specificity, yeah. But he's just gonna be overloaded with information, so I don't know how he's gonna feel about something. Yeah, because literally if I were to put on boxcar racer, I'd be like, Oh, do you remember listening to Blink 182? Okay, this is one of the this is two of the guys from this band, and they're not the other one, it was a problem. No, exactly. No, I've already told him we've listened to Blink songs, and I'm like, Oh, this is Mark singing, he's the bassist. Oh, this is Tom singing, he's the guitar. I've already said that to him. Do you hear the difference? He's three years old. And it's like in anime where it's harder to differentiate their voices, especially Mark wrote the verses, Tom wrote the choruses, so that's why they're juxtaposed. He's already been exposed to that at three years old.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02So any other kind of music that we introduce him, he's gonna know a background to it, and he's gonna know about the creative process, and he's gonna know about differentiating riffs and all this. I mean, he know like the this song that he likes, this 1980s song, which maybe will come to me if I were to think about it for more than two seconds, but it has a synthesizer solo. And so we're like, oh, here comes the solo. He's like, What's a solo? And it's like, oh, it's when one instrument plays a prominent part, it's usually kind of towards the end of the song, and it's that instrument featured. So this little weird synthesizer that you like it, there's a solo of it, it's kind of its part to shine here in this song. So he already knows that, and now he'll be like, Oh, it's the it's the synthesizer solo. So I don't know how his brain is gonna process music as yeah, he gets it to where because yeah, once you hit adolescence and go into those teenage years, music becomes your lifeblood. It can, you know what I mean? So yeah, and it might, it might not, I don't know, depending on how musically inclined or what he's interested in. But right now he seems he really likes music. He likes singing, he likes playing instruments.
SPEAKER_00And again, you guys are creative family, so like that will stay a constant in his life.
SPEAKER_02So, whatever. Whatever he wants to listen to, I don't give a shit. I'm not scared of any music or stuff like that. And with movies, it'll be yeah, try to keep him away from violence. Though, whatever. He was watching us play fucking Halo the other day, and he was he's three years old. So I'm not great about it.
SPEAKER_00Uh I think this needs to be further explored. He's seen a lot of random video games and probably random TV and random, like he's just caught glimpses of different things.
SPEAKER_02Mostly video games.
SPEAKER_00We need to you, we, it's not my kid, you need to lean into understanding something about Halo caught him more than any other game.
SPEAKER_02Oh, yeah. Well, I think it's either the chaos or it's the colors, colors, the flash.
SPEAKER_00The alien. There's something where he was like, he literally was like, I want to watch this.
SPEAKER_02Well, and I think Kira was a good juxtaposition of that because we were playing co-op for those who who don't know. So it's two people playing on the same television, and we're playing the remake uh that came out on PlayStation 5 of Halo 1 Combat Evolved, which is called Campaign Evolved.
SPEAKER_00Do you like specificity?
SPEAKER_02Maybe. Interesting. So, and Kira was like, I cannot watch this, I don't know which player to watch, the top or the bottom, and it's too confusing, really. And yeah, I absolutely agree with her, and we were talking about the visual fidelity, you know, getting in the way of some of the clarity of uh design, which I think is a problem with that game. But it's a difference between adults and children, where if kids see that, they're just like, holy shit, it's super stimulating to their brain, to where us as older people are like, okay, this is too much. Yeah. But I don't know. So it's I'd be curious to see if I played it in single player and it was slower paced, how much he would lock into it.
SPEAKER_00So I was thinking it might also be a little bit of the sci-fi. Yeah. That grabbed his brain. Cool design or something. James Bond looks like people. Yeah. Resident Evil looks like people, but uh stupid piece of shit, worst game ever. Death Training looks like people, but that's all real-looking stuff. Yeah, yeah. And then halos like blues and purples and shields and plasma. Like there's a he might just be drawn to like, I've never seen that before. Yeah. That doesn't look like anything I've experienced. And that might be in his head of like that's new. I like new, just different colors, different set.
SPEAKER_02And first person.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02And co-op is unique, so yeah. Because I don't think he's seen a first person game until that one. But yeah, it it did trigger something in him that was different. Yeah, I'd wonder because he'd seen Metroid and he didn't like Metroid because the plants, he was just like, I don't like the plants. Interesting. Because they would move. Yeah. But this was a year ago. So I wonder what he would think now.
SPEAKER_00Um I uh I did clock it and I was like, this is fascinating. Something here naturally grabbed to him that other games haven't. Yeah. There's something. And I I want to be that weirdo and ask him. Like, what is it, buddy? Yeah, yeah. What do you like? Next weekend you should ask him. I want to talk to him about it because I'm fascinated.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, what do you like about it? What's what do you see? Yeah, because he wasn't asking as many questions. Yeah, he was pretty sad. He's always just like, What are you doing? What's happening? Why? Literally, the characters are talking. He's like, What is happening? It's like, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, he's like, We gotta get out of here. He's like, What's happening? Yeah, we gotta get out of here. Yeah, that's what's happening. Yeah. I think that's a little kid like I I want a back and forth.
SPEAKER_02Is that he wants to be involved or something? Yeah. Talk to me. Yeah, yeah. I think I get that. And video game characters on the screen aren't the same as interacting with an actual person, I think. So it's just different.
SPEAKER_00Oh, I just embarrass myself. I still do that. Also, what do you mean? In uh relationships, I ask constantly what are you thinking? Oh, I'm generally curious, but it is also just a part of me of like, talk to me. Yeah. I ask, what are you thinking constantly? Yeah. And they're always like, I hate you. And said, Yeah, they're thinking, like, is this enough time for me to say I get it and I I am over it? Or do I have to give this more another shot? Bullshit. They're like, is this long enough to say I I did honestly try? Can I quit? That's what I'm thinking.
SPEAKER_02Can I tap out?
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Am I is it too soon? Yeah. Ouch. I don't know what you're talking about. Yeah. But yeah, I ask that all the time, like a little kid. What are you thinking?
SPEAKER_02Interesting, because we're the opposite. We always ask him, what do you think? What do you think? You know. But what are you thinking? That's too anxiety-inducing because it's putting somebody on the spot.
SPEAKER_00I want you on the s I want to know what's in your head this very moment. Just say it. Don't process it. Don't filter it. Don't even think about it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, my answer is leave me alone.
SPEAKER_00And that's what I don't know what are you thinking? Like, what there's no wrong answer. I want to know what you're experiencing right now. If we're eating dinner.
SPEAKER_02If you frame it in that way, that's nice. That's what I'm saying. But if people come from like controlling relationships and stuff like that, that's not good. No.
SPEAKER_00Let's be at dinner. You're middle eating, and I go, What are you thinking? And you're thinking of like, I'm chewing my food. I don't want to talk to my mom tomorrow. And I'm like, Yeah, that's fascinating to me. Or you're thinking of like, I've cooked this with an ex and it's making me sad. Like, I don't care the answer. Or my asshole's itching. Yeah. Like, I don't care the answer. I care that it's in your head. Interesting. There's no wrong.
SPEAKER_02Do well, you just want a glimpse into there.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. What are you thinking?
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Just say it. Interesting. Say you're annoyed. Say you want to leave me. Just let me know. I know. Because that's what you're looking for. Exactly. That's what that's what you're fishing for. It's not what I'm fishing for. Because it's also, I think, in a relationship, there's a there's a serious and a silly. The silly is I'm quick to make fart jokes.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_00And tell the girl, let her rip. My head of this is I assume, this is me assuming for another gender. I think women are always scared to fart. So they're walking around constantly uncomfortable. Sure. And cramped up because it's a level of judgment or unattractiveness. Yeah. I don't want the person I'm with to be uncomfortable. Yeah. So I'm like, just do what you gotta do. I need you comfortable.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00So just go for it. So like I break that barrier pretty quick. The other thing is the what are you thinking? Is like you can talk to me. You can open up. We can communicate. Like I like listening to you. Yeah. I'm not just gonna filibuster every single dinner.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, you give them the fart pass and hopes that they'll give you the shit pass.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, exactly. Yeah. I we will be like, hey, we actually gotta you gotta pull over.
SPEAKER_02Actually, you gotta stand outside the women's restroom.
SPEAKER_00I have to blow the women's restroom up right now. Yeah, you gotta run point on me. I'm gonna blow this women's bathroom up. I'm gonna I'm gonna create a hate crime in uh southern states. I'm gonna do something that's punishable as a felony in Florida and Texas. You gotta cover for me right now. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02That's fair.
SPEAKER_00Treat others as you would like to be treated. But no, yeah, yeah, I'm I'm big on what are you thinking? But it's so funny because you would you would hate that.
SPEAKER_02You would not enjoy what are you thinking with the framing of oh, I'm just I'm genuinely curious and want the unfiltered thing. I I like that framing. I think it works. But unprompted and unexplained, I would immediately be defensive, of course. The fuck you can't do it. Because like you're looking to get me in trouble. Yeah. The fuck you care. I don't want to be I I don't want to be in trouble. I don't like that shit. Dude, I walk I walk around schools as my job, and I think I'm gonna get in trouble. I'm a 38-year-old man, yeah, and I'm just like I just have that little kid self still inside me where I think I'm and I wasn't even a bad kid, I didn't get in trouble for a lot of stuff, but still I'm just like, oh shit. Like I'm gonna get yelled at. I just hated getting yelled at.
SPEAKER_00Your fight or flight's always on. Yeah, it's so bad. I hate it. I fucking hate it. Fucking bitch ass press boy scared to get yelled at. I know I hate it. Yeah, I don't have the fear, I have the fear of it, but I'm not constantly scared of getting in trouble. But it is the same thing of like, I don't want to be in trouble right now. Yeah, I'd rather die than fucking be in trouble. That's do a lot of things.
SPEAKER_02Well, but that's something between you and your therapist. I don't know what you're talking about. We're fine. Everything's fine. Speaking of everything being fine, what do you think about these fucking episodes?
SPEAKER_00Eight, nine, and ten. You're a weird person for saying this is a bleak, depressing show, and then going, Eee, Venkellion is kinda, but not really. I'm like, wait, what the fuck were you what show were you watching?
SPEAKER_02It's a different kind of sad. There's many there's being sad is multifaceted.
SPEAKER_00It is, is yeah, multitudes. Yeah, yeah. It's a spectrum. But uh it shows intense.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00These are less intense, these are getting more into fantasy fun idea. Yeah. And I'm I am liking that. I am liking that they had a silly plan to kill seven titans at once and shoot them in their face. There's tension, uh, you know, it's tense of like they're too close and you're scared someone's gonna bungle the mission up. But it was also a silly plan. Like that's a cartoony thing. I was like, yeah, we're getting silly with it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00There's a kid with superpowers now.
SPEAKER_02Yes.
SPEAKER_00This isn't just bleak war life is being destroyed. This is now, oh yeah, someone has superpowers.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, now it feels to me, this feels like the show has started now.
SPEAKER_00The fifth time we've every episode for the fourth time. It's like, we're officially started where I wrote the note down, I forgot about the key and the dad in the cellar. I forgot.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00So then he's like, wait, I was like, oh yeah, thank you for recapping this. Yes. Which is bad writing. This episode, the the I think eight and nine, some bad writing. Some bad on the nose dialogue.
SPEAKER_02I think that the whole show's been like that.
SPEAKER_00This one stood out to me.
SPEAKER_02I think I think the whole show stood out. Has not had good writing, and it's been very obvious. I do not like inner monologue, and I wanted to bring that up in this. We've maybe briefly touched upon it, but I don't like that shit.
SPEAKER_00I get that.
SPEAKER_02If you have to fucking tell me how you're feeling, just show me in your actions. But I guess it makes sense for animation where you're like, oh, I have this one frame and I'm gonna do some speed lines, and I can have the actors say what the fuck they're feeling instead of like actually having to really animate what's going on, you know, uh comparing it to other if you think of like Studio Ghibli or something like that. But like, which again is not a fair comparison, I know, but um Yeah, nothing's like Studio Ghibli. No, no, but I do I hate voice and it works in manga, it can work in comics. You have captions, you have the characters thinking that kind of stuff, but like I don't like it in in television or film. So I've thought about that this entire fucking show. I'm just like, stop fucking telling me how you feel, fucking do something, have a conversation with each other, don't just freeze up and fucking yell.
SPEAKER_00I feel like it's anime. I feel or animation, I think uh western animated stuff does it like Pixar kind of does it sometimes too. What we do with animation is you gotta say it. Ah, yeah, yeah. I'm scared of this. I just want my boy, I just wanna be real, or whatever, whatever it is. Like you gotta say stuff out loud. Pinocchio.
SPEAKER_02That's what an interesting poll. Or is that Toy Story? Yeah, I couldn't know.
SPEAKER_00No, it's uh Pinocchio, but like, yeah, I think animation, we say stuff out loud, the subtlety goes away, which I think is a fascinating for think about kids or something, quote unquote. Yeah, and most animation is most younger audio. Anime, because of the cultural difference, they are big on just stating the emotion, yelling for a like absolute. So it was a big Evangelian thing. Yeah, it's still here, but I think that's also why I give a pass to the inner monologue, is like I'm like, I think it's just a part of the the medium. Sure. I don't like it either. Yeah, I wouldn't write that, I wouldn't work with it, I don't enjoy it. I like voiceover and internal monologue stuff as like flavor text or funny.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I'm a I'm a Charlie Kaufman and a Terrence Malik boy.
SPEAKER_02Yep.
SPEAKER_00I don't like this, I wouldn't do it, but I give it a pass and I walk over it where I'm like, it doesn't bother me.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I mean it's a stylistic choice. I understand trying to save some money. And if you're adapting a manga that did it in captions and stuff like that, I get I get it, you know. Uh which I do want to read the first volume of the manga just to kind of see how close it follows it and that kind of thing.
SPEAKER_00I think it deviates towards the end from what was Henry Henry was saying, but um But I like I I do like these episodes, I like the revelations because they feel a little silly. This show does need silly. There is no humor, there is no uh. Yeah, there is no animal, there is no cute, there's no chibi thing. Yeah, so R.I.P. uh. your cat chibi. One of the few cats I've ever known that knew their name. Yep. You could just call her and she'd come hang out. Yep. Loved her. But I like the the silly, I I like the tone shift. I I hope we're getting into weird fantasy and mythology and stuff like that, because that's gonna help balance out the pure grim bleakness of getting chomped.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I think since we're learning these things about the Titans a little bit in terms of like well, I mean, we haven't said it, but I was right. Aaron You were partially right.
SPEAKER_00Aaron was that uh He was in it, he wasn't it, which was fascinating.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, but also He's like driving it. He's like driving it, he's in the back of their neck, and immediately as he emerges, Kira goes, Oh. So there's people in every one of them. That's why you cut the back of the neck and then you kill the person that's inside of it. You hit the driver. Pretty crazy. Yeah. So maybe that's where humanity's going, and maybe if you get chomped, because you the all those people in that stomach didn't seem dead, but they're floating in a soup of blood and bile. Good old belly blood soup. Yeah. Um my favorite. But uh, yeah, we're learning a little bit more. I like that it's now fantastical. Yeah, same. And you know, we get of course reintroduced the key, and he finally poses the question where has my dad been for the past five years?
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Because last we saw him, he was just galloping on a horse or something like that. So yeah, I I really enjoyed these episodes. It feels like we're finally fucking getting going. This, I mean, honestly, this feels like the start to the story because and if we're talking about story structure, which I I you know we do every once in a while, this feels like the inciting incident of the actual narrative. Which for those who aren't familiar with the inciting incident of a story, that is everything that comes before it was the world that was everything was the same until this one thing happens that propels the story forward. Happens either to the protagonist, to the world, or or something, and it forces the story to begin. Aaron dying and coming back, yeah, exactly, as a titan. Yeah, because up to then it was oh the titans attacked and we're scared of the titans. Prologue. That's the entire fucking thing before Aaron becomes a fucking Titan. Is everyone's fucking scary development? No, there is. There's backstory for sure, but it was the world as we knew it. The world hadn't changed until Aaron became a fucking Titan. And now it's gonna change how they fight the Titans, now it's gonna change everything. So that's why I feel like it's really this is the beginning. And I love just narratively that what does Aaron hate the most in the entire world? Titans. Guess what he can do? Turn into them. That's awesome. Yeah, that's a great little fucking twist. Easy. The thing that you like the most, or the thing that you hate the most in the world, guess what? You are one somehow. We don't know how. We know it has something to do with your dad, and some kind of needle he's sticking in you when he's crying. Yep. I'm just like, Jesus Christ. Dark. But that's a great fucking setup.
SPEAKER_00So yeah, I His dad's fauci, gave his kid a jab. That's what that is. Yeah, dude.
SPEAKER_02If a tag on Titan was the pandemic, the dude and if your brother That's the only reason why Sean wants us to watch it. That'd be the amaz the most amazing long play by Sean. It's just literally like an anti-vaxxer fucking narrative. That'd be beautiful. And he's just doing it to fuck with. Just fucking see what it does to you. Dude, that would be amazing. I would. Oh my god. He'd be my favorite person ever. Just like that long of a troll. That would be so fucking good. But yeah, I'm actually looking forward to watching this now. Because before this, I was just like, this is just bleak. They're just screaming. I mean, and even some of this episode where they're trying uh, you know, the fucking captain who's gonna shoot him with the and we knew that this guy was a fucking weird yeah, the sunken eye captain exactly the way that they animated him since you know the episodes prior. And it's just like, oh right, Jesus, and fucking Armin just screaming, ah blah blah blah, you know, I think we could use him. Like what whatever his argument is, I'm just like, yeah, no wonder the guy was gonna shoot you. That wasn't a great argument.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, you did bad.
SPEAKER_02But but uh I like the eccentric general guy who shows up, yeah. Who they planted the seed a couple episodes ago, you know, with the playing the the fat rich guy in chess, and now he's like, hey man, let's let's let's fucking use you, let's see what you can do. And I like the idea of you of of Aaron bites himself to become a Titan. That's kind of cool. And it's like based on instinct. So I'm like, okay, now the world is actually opening up, and look, there might be I fucking hope, and it seems like there's a glimmer of it, that them being so fucking scared of the titans is some kind of like preternatural thing. Like it has to deal with I I really hope it ties into the story somehow, and it because it kind of becomes apparent here where they're they are so fucking scared of Aaron and the captain saying, like, are you human or are you a titan? Which is just like just just say you're a human, you know, but he doesn't believe. But but I'm like, there's gotta be something, they know we're doing something wrong.
SPEAKER_00This ties into something that we didn't talk about previously because it was holding off when I was doing my research for Alex Garland's men. Okay, there was an interview, and in the interview, they asked him that they heard he was inspired by Attack on Titan. Ooh, and I turned it off and I didn't hear his answer. Yeah, the Titan growing out of the other Titan. Yeah, I was like, there we go. That's men, that's men. Yep, and then also what you're talking about the incomprehensible of I don't know where they come from, I don't know what they want, they don't need us for energy, they look happy, they're running around, they are naked but with no genitalia. Why are they small? Why are they big? Like it I don't understand what it is, and there's just a general internal animalistic pure fear that these are eliciting out of us. Yeah, and I was like, that's also something, and there's something to transformation. There's a lot of like, okay, I can definitely now see Alex Garland watching this show and going, Yeah, this is up my alley. Yeah, this is for me. I like this.
SPEAKER_02This is this is for me. Yeah, it's it explore some concepts that he definitely finds interesting.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and I bet you we'll get even further into there. I bet you we'll be able to talk about Alex Garland more the further we get in because it feels like like you said, like it does feel like the show just started, but so we're not even there yet.
SPEAKER_02No, yeah, and I've almost run across some at least spoiler art on Instagram because one of the artists I followed uh was posting some kind of fan art and it looked pretty fucking crazy. I'm like, all right, don't pay attention to this. Don't look at how many characters are in the foreground.
SPEAKER_00Don't look at don't look at what yeah, don't check silhouettes, yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, but I'm I'm excited now. Yeah, actually, yeah, I'm like, okay, cool. Now we can finally get some fucking answers, and it feels like the story has finally begun after 10 episodes.
SPEAKER_00And I want the answers.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00That's yeah, and I'm not watching. It's a cool power. It's a cool power. Um I I I've been liking the show. I've not been loving it, but I've been liking it. Outside of episode one and two, I'm like, yeah, no, I like this. I'm definitely gonna stick with it. I'm not as uh critical as you are. I also don't mind the time they took to tell the story the way they're telling it, because I do think it's it's making the bleakness more bleak and the gravity is hitting harder because of how much time they spent. I'm just hoping that magic trick pays off.
SPEAKER_02Yes, I hope it's worth it.
SPEAKER_00I should be caring and loving and missing and things like that more with characters because I spent time with them. And Aaron coming back fucked up and weird, and him in the the stomach and stuff like that. I was like, Yeah, this means more. Like, I I feel I am more connected to Aaron because of how much time, not just that we spent, but also how it affected his friends when he died.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I was like, all of this is playing into now that he's back, but it's not just him. It's like it's complicated now.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Yeah, and I definitely felt like when they were pointing all their guns and the cannon and the the captain, you know, or whatever was was gonna attack him. I was like, oh shit, yeah, okay. I was I was feeling engaged emotionally engaged in it, you know.
SPEAKER_00And something about blind leading or blind following of a command.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Of you you're just gonna kill these kids because you're scared. Yeah. Yeah. I I love talking about the military in the sense of you're the you're a mindless husk of an arm of authoritarianism. Yeah, there's like and that's what this was in that moment. And I was like, yeah, I'm glad that's here. I'm glad we get to see you all as just brain dead, you're gonna do whatever you're told.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, there's a lot of things. There's a great line. Yeah, when push comes to shove, all of us are monsters. Great line. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Awesome line. Yeah. And the guy who says it, the stupid ass general, sunken eye bastard. Exactly. Yeah. I'm also perfectly fine with the freeze frame still image anime thing. Like, I think I'll I'll never notice it now. These episodes kept doing it, and I was like, I don't care. I'm fine. You get used to the style. That's what I meant. Yeah, I'm I'm used to the style.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, Kira wasn't digging it, but I was like, yeah, uh, yeah. It's so the action scenes look better. That's all that's all my brain. I'm just trying to turn that off and like, oh, they they don't want to animate 10 people walking down the steps because they want to save it for the action. Because this shit's expensive and takes forever. Yep. Yep. So we'll see if it continues in later seasons. I'm gonna take it by season by season, basically. Yeah, yeah. The budgets get bigger, maybe more is animated. We'll see.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Hopefully they don't go too CG with the animation. Because it gets jarring.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, we'll see. Because it's it helps with perspective for sure. Yeah. That's what they do. They 3D model the landscapes and you know that kind of thing. So it's easier to push cameras through the space grooves and all that stuff. Yeah.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_00Any random stuff? Captain Lee has a cape. Capes are cool. Oh, yeah. I saw him in a cape. That was cool. And I immediately knew that's a cool guy. That's how capes work, people.
SPEAKER_02I like the slow-mo punch of the two who are like being in the creepers and the HP. Double punch. Yeah, I love that's a good use of slow motion. It's very fun.
SPEAKER_00Uh right before they get punched, just the noises of them chewing on people. Yeah, yeah. Disgusting. Hated it. I liked it of how much I hated it. I like the flower mystery. Speaking of mysteries, I have no idea, but that's immediately cool to me. It's like, oh, that wasn't there before. And Armin points it out, so you know it means something. It's important. And then I immediately go back to that was in episode one. You feel the flowers.
SPEAKER_02Oh, yeah, true.
SPEAKER_00So I'm like, what the fuck's the flowers about? That's exciting.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and I like the captain or the yeah, the guy, the cape guy's line you just said, where he's like, I know it's not your guys' fault, you're so ugly, but I can't help but being tired of looking at you. Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00What about the line? Eaten by a titan wouldn't be so bad if it was a sexy lady one. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02I'm like, all right, here's the perv. Look at it. And he's bald. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I don't get the big lady thing. I don't get it.
SPEAKER_02Oh, like being attracted to large ladies?
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Just like being smothered, I guess. I don't know.
SPEAKER_00I don't get it. Yeah. I mean, smothered, well, okay. I can kind of get that, and I guess it's an exaggeration of that. Maybe. It feels performative. Should try it out. Should try it out. The fetish feels performative. So we talk about people talk about it.
SPEAKER_02Are we talking about large women like six foot tall?
SPEAKER_00Or Resident Evil Village Lady, and how everyone's like, that's the hottest thing ever. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Or maybe eight feet tall. Like it's a dominatrix thing. Yeah, I feel it's a little performative. I don't know. I don't know either.
unknownI don't know.
SPEAKER_00I feel certain fetishes get performative. I don't think that many people are in defeat. I have no idea, to be honest. I also don't think that many people like eating ass. They found out it's not that bad, so they just do it, but they're not like, oh yeah, I like it. I think you thought it was gonna be horrible and gross, then you didn't, you're like, oh, it's whatever. And then you do it, but it became performative of like, oh, I eat ass. Like that's crazy. It's not crazy. I don't know. Whatever. Whatever you think, I think the same thing. I was just kidding. I if you do it, I do, and if you don't, I've never done it. You're whatever we're more in the know than I am out there, so I didn't know that.
SPEAKER_02That is that something that you put on your profile, will eat ass.
SPEAKER_00Uh the gay profiles uh I wouldn't know. So why would I answer and give you an explicitly deeply detailed answer of how it goes on other apps? Why would I do that?
SPEAKER_02I thought dudes would do anything. So why would you have to even specify?
SPEAKER_00No, because again, why am I doing this? I'm gonna justify all of this. The way the the gay apps work is your filters are insane. Okay. Ethnicity, height, weight, hair, no hair, like preference, like you can be so racist and discriminatory because they're men, yeah. Because it's men to men. They're like, I specifically want hairless Filipino, 21 years old, spinner, switch domain. Like you get so specifically in the fine-tuned details, sure. And then on the the hetero apps, it's Democrat, Republican, Christian, non-denom. Yeah, I like cats or dogs.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, because men have to hide what how much of monsters we are for women.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, women cannot say only tall men in your preferences, and men can't say no fat chicks. Yeah, yeah. So you gotta play around all of that. But the gay apps, they just straight go for it. And the pictures for the gay apps, they'll just show you your your your profile picks just your asshole.
SPEAKER_02Oh, okay.
SPEAKER_00Wow. I'm here to have sex. This is what I'm doing. Yeah, this is what you're dealing with. This is all I'm here for. I you know, and they go for it. I commend the honesty. I do too. There they're again transparency to it. There's not just that, there's an industriousness of this is what technology was supposed to do. You're cutting through the bullshit. Yeah, yeah. You're fine-tuning the experience to be as fast to the solution as possible. This is a calculator for coming. Sure. Two plus two hits equals immediately gives you a four.
SPEAKER_02Alliteration.
SPEAKER_00It's right there, and that's what these apps are. They're using technology to its full extent, going, I just want to bust. Yeah. And I want to bust with a specific thing. Yeah. Just cut to chase and tell you. And if you're that thing, talk to me. If you're not that thing, I hope you die, get out of my life, and I'll see you again. Not interested. So I I respect that. I respect that so much. They took all the game and the dance out of it. For sure. That's cool. Good for them. I wouldn't know all of this is hearsay.
SPEAKER_02Sure. Of course. I don't know. Yeah, this is all just something you read online.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Didn't experience or create a profile or anything. No, for sure. Which if you did, no judgment. No one cares except for you.
SPEAKER_00It's the the tires thing. I'm totally straight. I'm sure you are. Only like women. Uh point of view inside the Titan. Yes. That was creepy. Yeah. And the the soup people talking to him, just bobbing up and down, and then they sink in. Yeah. And his eyes are missing. Disturbing. Oh yeah. Very disturbing. Effective.
SPEAKER_02Yep. Yeah, it's uh it's a very gross. They get chomped, man. Yep. That's true.
SPEAKER_00Gulped on down.
SPEAKER_02Gulped on down.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I'm I'm I want to know what's happening.
SPEAKER_02Finally.
SPEAKER_00I'm here for it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I'm definitely here for it. I've been here for the last two, three episodes, but now that it's silly fantasy, anime, weird ideas, superpowers, I'm like, hell yes. Now I I want to have some fun. You bummed me out. You totally bummed me out. Yeah, feudal medieval bummer shit. I'm like, all right. I couldn't do that for five seasons. If this was the saddest show of all time for five seasons, I couldn't do it.
unknownNo.
SPEAKER_00Absolutely. I mean, I was getting drained on even going, and it's one season. Just one. Yeah. And you're going through some stuff. And then he played the when am I not? I don't know, man. That's fair. I almost died this year. It happens. Not good. No. Glad you're still here. Whatever. Me too. Spider-Man was great. I almost missed Spider-Man, Nick. I know. That's what I gotta do. I gotta call somebody next time I get there. And instead of the bullshit lie of like, oh, everyone loves you and everyone cares about you and everyone wants you here. Yeah, the bullshit lie. Yeah, I just need to call somebody and they go, okay, November 12th is this movie. Yeah. You know Beyonce's coming out. Jay-Z's gonna drop another album. That's true. Like Vin Stable's going on tour. Like I need I need that of someone to remind me. Wolverine looks pretty cool. Yeah. Next month. It's a waves. Wind and waves. There's gonna be cool water types. Yeah. You love a water type. Supposed to be a lot of new Pokemon in that. Yeah, see, so like that's the phone call I need is like Dune 3. Yeah. Danny's back. Yeah. Don't forget. And I'm like, all right, you're right. Okay. I'm here for that. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02That's very true.
SPEAKER_00Hey, it's the little things that they keep if they keep you going. It's literally nothing but little things. Little rooms, little things. Speaking of little things, I wrote three things for my notes in episode 10. Some reason that episode, I was just like, I got nothing to write.
SPEAKER_02I just focused. I didn't write that much for that one either.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. It was the shortest, just like five or six lines. That happens sometimes. Yeah. It can be good or bad. Sometimes I write nothing because I'm like, I'm not clicking. I'm not paying attention or I'm not invested, or I'm super invested. Yeah. And I'm like, I don't need to take notes. I know what to talk about. That better call saw a lot. Yes. Of like, there's nothing I need to. I'm taking notes for episode titles, and that's it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Because we know what we're talking about.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Hamlin got domed. That's what we're talking about. R.I.P. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I'm glad me and you are both clicking more with the official start of the show. Ten episodes in. It officially has been.
SPEAKER_02Okay, it's 25 episodes, I think. So of this first season.
SPEAKER_00So it's all right. It's not crazy. Yeah, it's an inciting incident, first 10 pages of a script. Yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_02Here we are. Yeah, we just we got through what they call the ordinary world. Yep. We set the table. Yes. And let's get to eating. And now the world is going to change. The world of our protagonists is changing. So yeah, glad we're we're the the show is officially started. And yeah, we can get into the fucking meat of it. Because yeah, we got four seasons, four, five, four seasons to go. Four seasons in a movie. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, we'll be back next week for the next three parts, which I think is gonna wrap up this little mini arc. I think it's a nine-parter. So we'll do episodes 1113.
SPEAKER_00Let's see what bullshit they do with the titles.
SPEAKER_02They're gonna start doing parentheses and semicolons. And I hope, I genuinely hope that there's some method to the madness with those. That'd be fucking hilarious. That is funny. But who knows? You'll have to get on uh the 4chan those days are over, Nick. Well, 8 chan, whatever.
SPEAKER_00I'm off it. I don't do any of that stuff anymore. Sure.
SPEAKER_02It's the old me. The dark web and and see if there are some theories out there. It's the old me. Uh we'll be back next week. Thank you for joining us.
SPEAKER_00I love you.
SPEAKER_02I love you too.